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Pact W/ The Devil, Crossroads Rite, Etc.

To: alt.lucky.w,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.satanism,talk.euthanasia,,alt.satannet,alt.magick,alt.paranormal.spells.hexes.magic,alt.christnet.demonology,alt.politics.satanism
From: (SOD of CoE)
Subject: Pact W/ The Devil, Crossroads Rite, Etc. (was making a pact)
Date: 7 Oct 1999 21:54:42 -0700


here I respond to the rest of the thread on Pacts With the Devil.
Halskov  responds to's 
 inquiries about "a pact with the devil":
#># What would the point of making a pact with the "devil" be? 
#># It is my experience that there is no supreme evil other than 
#># that which resides within yourself. To make a pact with 
#># this evil would be to embrace this side of yourself, which 
#># in the end would only lead to sadness and delusions.

'the devil' per se, or Der Teuffel, the Wild Man, the Black
Man at the Crossroads, and Krampus the St. Nicolaus 
alter-ego, is well-documented by magical and religious
traditions in American and European cultures. you can see
a picture of Krampus with your browser on the top level 
page of the TOKUS Satanism Archive at:

pacts with this being have been made for centuries, and
the nature of carrying them out seems to vary depending
on how the pact-maker sees the being in question. due to
the Christianization of Europe and the Americas there is
some intersection of identity of the "Satan" of Christian 
lore and legends with it, especially as portrayed in the
highly propagandistic legends of "Faust" by Marlowe and

motivation for making such a pact are usually for the
benefit of the mage or mystic in question. the bargain
varies considerably depending on the notions the mage
has of the being with whom she is making the agreement.

Christians have for years presumed that the arrangement
was doctrinally-determined and that this need include a 
trade of one's "soul" (spiritual identity or substance 
by the essentialist and dualistic cosmological schema) 
for some temporary material, social, magical or 
intellectual gain such as wealth, fame, occult power, 
wisdom, sex, particular information, revenge, etc.

and yet by those of less 'erudite' Christian or
entirely different religious or atheistic peoples
the pact, deal or bargain one may make with the Devil
can be temporary, can include service in exchange for
instruction (the Devil is reputed to be the master
of many human arts and sciences), and SHe can even be
tricked into providing treasures or benefits without
having to actually pay for them. see stories like that
about Daniel Webster, songs like 'The Devil Went Down
to Georgia', and accounts by individuals (e.g. 'when 
the time comes to pay, give him the SOLE OF YOUR SHOE')
like those interviewed by Harry M. Hyatt (see the 
beautiful page on the man and his work by sri 
catyananda at: )

in which a certain spell is effected and they sell
themselves to the Devil in exchange for power, musical 
or magical acumen, or so as to secure him as an ally.

Entari/Kendar Deltos :
#> I must say you are wrong about the "only" part. I have 
#> embraced my evil, and now it is one among many tools for 
#> my everyday life.  Thinking about it, I would say you 
#> are wrong about making a pact with evil is embracing it. 

dualistic religious tend to blame all the things that they
don't like on some grand cosmic antagonist. the dualists
amongst Christians have chosen the bogey they call 'Satan'
and loaded the responsibility for all the world's "evils"
(from real travesties like torture and violence to fallacious
'evils' like breaking religious laws and fucking with the
wrong people, even consensually, or ingesting the wrong 
foods or psychoactives). 

I find that forming an alliance with what is inside myself
that is difficult and even apparently dangerous to me is
to my overall benefit. eshewing the natural which is at
odds with me as something which I'd like to see destroyed
(rather than opposed and resolved with compassion) just
feeds the fires of the Big Bad Meanie the fundies detest.
far better to befriend the Beast and see what progress
may be made toward mutually-desired objectives.

the first step to resolving internal dissonance is the
willingness to compromise toward shared goals. this is
the method of Gandhi and of many nonviolent activists,
and I feel that it ought to be the method of anarchists
and all who seek to avoid harm in their interactions.

#> A pact is an agreement (I scratch your back kind of deal) 
#> between you and another for a service to be performed. 
#> And it is a bad idea to make deals with evil (especially 
#> your own.) To embrace something is to accept it for what 
#> it is, and in some cases take control.

I don't know why making a pact is so treacherous. treaties
between hostile nations can become the groundwork upon
which is eventually constructed a lasting peace.

if one sees this as all some sort of Jungian Shadow-play,
then making a pact would be a valuable act in that it
begins a negotiation with the suppressed and alien parts
of oneself. working to resolve this Shadow is an important 
element in self-individuation, personal maturity, and
the healthy growth of one's personality. 

I'll leave the idea of 'making a pact with evil' to the
dualists who believe in this kind of cosmological paradigm. 
I think it is a personal and social fracture from which 
dualists will long be attempting to recover and am 
content to oppose that which I detest (like torturing 
innocents) rather than ascribe some sort of divinely moral 
character to it.

------------------------------------------------------------- (Francisco Del valle):
#> [If] you want to make a pack with the devil then why don't
#> you ask him . He's on earth right now. He's waiting on the 
#> sidelines at the moment waiting for when his time is ready 
#> to take control of the world....

this Revelations-based character is not the same as the Devil
of the Crossroads, though there may be some common qualities
(such as their affinity with beasts, the wild, intersections
between worlds, the arts, etc.).

# ...satan has no need to make a personal pact with anyone 
# because he will have a pact with the whole world. 

according to a variety of sources the Devil does indeed
have an interest in pacts, and the nature of these pacts
seems to vary considerably: from sacrifices of animals
to being present at the Crossroads at the proper times
and with the right gear (for more specific accounts of
Crossroads rites, see the web page at Lucky Mojo:

which was also written and filled with Hyatt
interviews by sri catyananda). the Devil seems to get
something real and desired out of the deal, and some
Satanists believe that this being is promethean in
character -- wanting the best for human beings and
providing technologies (e.g. fire, magic) to enhance 
hir development and station, at times in exchange
for service or collaboration.
"Lord Dread_not" :
# ...Satan can't take your soul by force, he will indeed 
# make a pact with you as you are offering it willingly.

not only this, but for many the notion of a "soul", as 
well as "God" is considered ridiculous, and so the pact-
maker may refer to the bargain as having 'sold THEMSELVES
to the Devil' (as into slavery). sri catyananda has wisely
suggested that this may be the attitude of those whose
ancestors have already known such servitude (e.g. those of
African heritage brought to the Americas). having sold
oneself, this is of course subject to all the limitations
and potential fractures that any agreement of this kind
may yield: one may buy back one's freedom, the terms of
agreement may terminate the contract after a period of
time such as 7 or 9 years, and even Christians tend to
agree that one can appeal to more powerful sources for
assistance in getting out of the arrangement if it
becomes problematic (what this more powerful authority
might be varies of course depending on one's perspective,
though often it is a magician or priest with a reputation).

"Lord Dread_not" :
# The entire faith of satan worship is based on sophism and 
# half truths.  [They] take the text from the bible, 
# rephrasing what they like and commence to worship a being 
# who (according to the bible) is doomed to be trashed in the
# end....

Christian Satanists like these are few and far between from
what I can tell. usually the cosmology is changed so as to
suit the worshipper.

# ...History dictates that the devil takes more than he gives 
# and the price of power, which seems cheap when you first 
# contemplate it, will blow your mind in the end.

this is the story which fundamentalists of many stripes would
like us to believe. it is the typical Faustian bad-deal story
which has us running to avoid the bogey at any cost. let me
correct you in stating that your 'history' is faulty if it be
drawn on folklore and the testimonies of numerous peoples,
since these are rather more on the side of the Devil as a
potentially wily but fairly predictable fellow.

# I'm not saying that I harbour a belief in satan, only that 
# there is a force of nature out there that one could
# easily mistake for him.

here is where I tend to agree strongly. my understanding is
that the figure of "Satan", "Shaitan", "Iblis", or even
"Ahriman" is personalization of natural forces which we may
fear and loathe due to being ignorant animals bent on 
preserving our genetic strain and organismic lives. if we 
can come to see the bigger picture we'll realize how perfect 
are all portions of the cosmos even while we may fight to
our last breath against a predator who has come to kill 
and eat us.

it is MY intent to change the consciousness of the human
species toward a wider perspective, and it is the goal of
my church, the Church of Euthanasia, to reframe the notion
of death and our place as a single species within what we
may call the biosphere in which we live so that we might
come to live PEACEABLY with other species rather than
continuing to RAPE, PILLAGE and PLUNDER, exploiting
whatever we may lay our hands upon in the pursuit of our
selfish and ultimately puny goals.

for more about the Church of Euthanasia, see the web page:

Trancser :
#># I think there is a such thing, as screwing up on a pact.

now here is one thing which is seldom discussed by those
who write of pact-making with the Devil (or whatever they
choose to call the being): if no consequences of defaulting
on the pact are made, then what will this Devil do? 

I do not take too seriously those who describe a coerced 
or unwilling compact or one in which one is TRICKED or 
EXTORTED into making it. if there is nothing which the 
Devil in question is going to gain, then why would SHe 
make the deal in the first place?

no, instead I think that SHe must either have some power 
to enforce the terms of the agreement (through haranguing 
or harassing the person trying to weasel out of the deal
or exacting some type of revenge -- influencing their 
fortune, for example), or there will be some detriment 
to having made the agreement without repayment (the gold 
for which they bargained turns back to straw and the 
law is immediately upon the heels of the pact-breakers, 
for example; stories like this abound).

from all accounts I've read the Devil is rather patient
with stupidity, ill-conceived quick-rich schemes, and
explanations as to why one could not come through on
their part of the bargain. see such lovely compendia
of folk tales as Rudwin's "The Devil in Legend and
Literature", Grimm's fairy tale compilation(s), or
"Devils", edited by Isaac Asimov as I remember.
#> like not living up to your end of the deal.  
#> Just ask any businessman.

the Devil is reputed to be an excellent businessman.
sometimes a lawyer. the Book of Job (a Jewish Satan)
portrays the Devil as a wandering (malak) Sheriff and
District Attorney for Jehovah, for example.

#># ...does anyone ... here ...truely believe, that a being 
#># known ... [as] DEVIL/SATAN ...actually exits?

I'm pretty sure of it. I signed a pact in blood with Hir
and think that SHe is living up to Hir end of the bargain
in spectacular fashion. details about this pact can be
found at the following web page:
#> I think that the whole business of selling souls is a christian
#> invention and has nothing to do with reality.

it smacks very strongly of the Simon Magus of biblical historical
fiction: someone who offered to purchase the secret of the holy
transubstantiation from Peter and was soundly rebuked for being
such an enterprising competitor (er blasphemer).
#># ...if someone wants proof that whatever might be in doubt, 
#># exists, they are presented physical, emperical evidence, right?
#> If the object of the proof is physical.

and as long as the object can have some INFLUENCE on the physical
world and wishes (if it has desires) to be known.
Trancser :
# ...physical evidence is proof of physical phenomena,
# not in exactly the same words.  That non physical existance 
# can be "proved" with a physical existance, but not 
# necessarily.  The link between the "proof" and the 
# non-physical existance is out of necessity non-physical.

the problem with this type of assertion is that:
     a) criteria for proof are usually contested between
	cosmological systems

     b) no connection between 'physical' and 'non-physical'
	is in any way rationally explained as a context

     c) there is no logical necessity that evidence of 
	non-physical existence must be physical unless
	one proceeds from the paradigm that *all*
	evidence is necessarily physical of character
	(the predominate opinion of modern Science).

questions of how the non-physical influences the physical
immediately comes up, and why some non-physical being
could not make itself known to any individual through,
say, sound, or thought, or synchronicity, is unexplained 
(I have met quite a few gods by these methods, for example).

#># ...why [would] someone want to meet HIM...?

because the Devil is said to possess extraordinary knowledge,
a mastery of magic and artistry, and this mastery can be
conferred upon those who are willing to deal for it. because
it is an ordeal which only the most fearless (or foolish!) of 
magicians would undertake for the very fact (or lack) of its
# ...What made you come to the conclusion, that this being 
# known as the devil, exists?

reading about Hir, contemplating Hir nature, to what people
might be referring when they mentioned Hir, and conversations
with my goddess. :>
# ...notifing authorities [would] be a better solution...[than]  
# hiring the assistance of some metaphysical being....

unless the being *was* an authority. :>

# ...assuming we are referring to THE "devil", the keeper of 
# hell itself, 

Ruler of the Underworld (remember the Christians could be
wrong about the afterlife *and* the Underworld). cf. the
text "Underworld Initiation" by R.J. Stewart for more
information on this with respect to the Faerie for one
example. some Native Americans have an Underworld also
which, if memory serves, does not resemble a Dantean Inferno.

# the numero-uno god of darkness/hell/damnation? 

there's that dualistic 'damnation' thing again. ignoring
that (since I don't believe in or support any god or God
which might have set something like that up), gods of
darkness and the Underworld are sometimes very admirable.
#> usually, when people invoke a demon, it is done deliberately, 
#> and whether or not they believe he actually exists is 
#> immaterial.  by doing certain things certain results will follow.

a lovely hypothesis, and one of the reasons that I think that
sorcerers are prone to demon-summoning of the same type.

#> All I can suggest is reading "Pacts with the Devil" by 
#> Hyatt & Black.  just reading the book won't invoke any devils.

I didn't like that book very much. it struck me as very
simplistic and limited in scope. what is it about that book,
as compared to something like "Goetic Evocation", by Saevdow
(which I also didn't agree with but liked more), that you 
particularly enjoyed and found valuable?
# ...illistrate a representation, of what *the devil* looks 
# like for you, again assuming you have seen him/her/it before?

the best representative icons I've yet to find are those which
integrate a number of species to one being. the picture of
"Aziel, Guardian of the Treasures", which appears on the TOKUS
web page near the bottom on the right (in browsers) was scanned 
from M. Rudwin's "The Devil in Legend and Literature", as I
mentioned above, and was published by Open Court in 1973. it
has elements which I have identified with the 'King of Demons'
for more than two decades, and these may also be found in
such pictures as that of "Baphomet" as rendered by Eliphas
Levi (which I'll eventually get around to scanning too :> --
but you can find it in many books on occultism such as
Levi's "Transcendental Magic", and it is probably contained 
in your local library's reference section or that numbered 
near 133; Cavendish's black and white occult encyclopedia
probably has a copy of it).

the trick is that Satan as I understand Hir can appear in any
guise and form that will suit Hir purposes with the individual
in question. if SHe wants to be scary, SHe'll look pretty
horrific, if SHe wants to be reassuring, SHe'll look lovely
and sheltering. as SHe is the WILD ONE, you gotta be kinda
careful around Hir, but as with many wild animals, once you
gain Hir confidence SHe is reliably considerate.


blessed beast! (SOD of CoE)
--  ;
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