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TOP | RELIGION | THELEMA | PHILOSOPHYVarious: Was Rabelais a Thelemite
To: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,talk.religion.misc,alt.satanism
From: tyagi@houseofkaos.abyss.com (nigris (333))
Subject: Various: Was Rabelais a Thelemite
Date: 3 May 1997 03:17:09 -0700
[from thelema93-l@hollyfeld.org: Jeffrey Smith ]
[technical difficulties enforced delay -- apologies for outdatedness]
Since we are back to debating the subject of preCrowley Thelema, I have a
question to pose, already mentioned by someone (David). Just how
"Thelemic" were all these predecessors?
Take Rabelais: he devised an Abbey of Thelema and gave it a motto:
but how Thelemic is that Abbey? From what I remember of the description
given in Gargantua and Pantagruel, it is much more like an idealized coed
dorm full of upper and upper-middle class students than anything else:
with plenty of servants who serve. And while obviously some of them
might be engaged on the Great Work, there is no stated purpose to all
this delightful existence: one could diddle away one's life just as
easily there. [Of course, perhaps diddling away one's life is actually
an effective means of achieving the Great Work.] The motto as applied
does indeed carry more of the meaning "do as you wish" than "do as you Will".
Whether we accept it or not, the Crowley model and terminology is the
Thelema we all have in mind when we speak of Thelema; and much of it did
indeed originate with Crowley. I happen to find that the terminology
translates very neatly into the terminology of Christianity, of Judaism,
of Islam, etc.--if only because all ways are one, and there is nothing
new under the sun. While this knowledge does not make me a better or a
worse magician, it does have its benefits.
On the other hand, I've never heard of Throbbing Gristle, and I
definitely like Thomas Tallis.
Jeffrey Smith f901030k@bc.seflin.org
This is the bread of affliction that our ancestors ate in the land of
Egypt. All who are hungry, come and eat! All in need, come and join in
the Passover celebration! This year we are here, next year in the Land
of Israel! This year slaves, next year free men!--Haggadah shel Pesach
======================================================================
"In their rule was only this clause:
DO WHAT YOU WILL [FAY CE QUE VOULDRAS]
because people who are free, well born, well bred, moving in honourable
social circles, have by nature an instinct and goad which always impels
them to virtuous deeds and holds them back from vice, which they called
honour. These people, when by vile subjection and constraint they are
oppressed and enslaved, turn aside this noble affection by which they
freely tended toward virtue, to throw off and infringe this yoke of
servitude: for we always undertake forbidden things and covet that which
is denied us."
This is anything but a naive whimsicalism. It postulates a particular
mental force which makes for virtue within oneself, contrasting it with
servitude. It is (fortunately) not so metaphysically grandiose as
Crowley's idea of the True Will, but it is plainly the seed of that idea.
The members of the Abbey lived their lives in the refinement of various
virtuous arts, whether dancing, hunting, sewing, writing, music,
language, according to the dictates of this inner goad to virtue, and
surrounded by the beauties of all the arts. A more Thelemic ideal could
hardly be imagined.
>I happen to find that the terminology [of Crowley's Thelema]
>translates very neatly into the terminology of Christianity, of Judaism,
>of Islam, etc.--if only because all ways are one, and there is nothing
>new under the sun.
That's one of the main reason I'm not enamored of Crwoley's system of
thought -- it is in fact largely isomorphic to traditional religion. I
realized twenty-three years ago that I didn't believe in God, but it took
me some ten years laboring under Crowley's system to realize that the
True Will is God and that I don't believe in that either.
Tim Maroney
EOF
--
see http://www.hollyfeld.org/~tyagi/nagasiva.html and call: 408/2-666-SLUG!!!
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