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To: alt.magick,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.mythology
From: markovic@io.com
Subject: Re: Origins of Beelzebub, and Other Spirits...
Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 22:38:55 -0500

beelzebub appears in the new testament. the pharisees complain that jesus'
powers come from beelzebub. in some versions of this narrative it is
rendered beelzebul.

this has led to a theory that the phariees are referring to zebulon, a
tribe of isreal. this tribe ceased to exist in 722bc, but its territory
was in the area of jesus' home in galilee.

this theory proposes that zebulon had a god named lord-of-zebulon, a deity
not specificly known to exist [although other posts to this thread have
noted a philistine baalzebul]. the only god of zebulon that i am aware of,
outside the orthodox el/yahweh, is terah.

thus, the pharisees meant that jesus' teachings were just old-fashioned
superstition based upon a heretical demon. anyway that's the theory.

other renderings: baalzebub appears in the old testament. baalzebul
appears in the dungeons and dragons game.

-- 
markovic@io.com

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From: Senior 
Newsgroups: alt.magick,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.mythology
Subject: Re: Origins of Beelzebub, and Other Spirits...
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 06:18:49 GMT
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Words and names and titles all get shared and moved about through time,
from civilization to civilization.  The Name Baal was a god in one
civilization, a god/dess in another, a title in yet another, and a
lowly spirit in another, and finally translated into a more modern
tongue comes up as a stubborn ass .  So, take each in turn,
and ask for a date and place for each translation.  Tis the only way to
get a more correct understanding.  Cause otherwise, if all taken at
once, they are all correct.

In article ,
  markovic@io.com wrote:
> In article <5VxO4.6653$rR2.768807@nnrp3.clara.net>, "Kwaw"
>  wrote:
>
> > Yet Baal was addressed as "whether God or Goddess"; suggesting that
gender
> > was no so clear-cut.
>
> really- where? i thought the equivalent title for a goddess is baalit.
>
> --
> markovic@io.com
>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

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From: "S.Rubinstein" 
Newsgroups: alt.magick,alt.magick.tyagi,alt.mythology
Subject: Re: Origins of Beelzebub, and Other Spirits...
Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 17:58:25 +0200
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Senior schreef:

> Words and names and titles all get shared and moved about through time,
> from civilization to civilization.  The Name Baal was a god in one
> civilization, a god/dess in another, a title in yet another, and a
> lowly spirit in another, and finally translated into a more modern
> tongue comes up as a stubborn ass .  So, take each in turn,
> and ask for a date and place for each translation.  Tis the only way to
> get a more correct understanding.  Cause otherwise, if all taken at
> once, they are all correct.
>
> In article ,
>   markovic@io.com wrote:
> > In article <5VxO4.6653$rR2.768807@nnrp3.clara.net>, "Kwaw"
> >  wrote:
> >
> > > Yet Baal was addressed as "whether God or Goddess"; suggesting that
> gender
> > > was no so clear-cut.
> >
> > really- where? i thought the equivalent title for a goddess is baalit.
> >
> > --
> > markovic@io.com
> >
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.

In Hebrew, Baal simply means "master".The Talmud calls God "baal shem Tov"
which means "Master with the good name".