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To: alt.magick.tyagi,alt.magick,alt.tarot,alt.divination,talk.religion.newage,alt.pagan.magick From: 333Subject: Thoth Deck Experiences (Harris-Crowley) Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2003 06:16:29 GMT 50030730 NULatix! viii om # I have heard a lot about the Thoth deck. People seems to # feel strongly about it. re Thoth deck: the type of art and the occultist behind the fashioning of the deck seem to elicit strong emotional responses. I know I had one (positive, power-based) when I found it and have observed several from 'Ewww! That deck is *evil*!' to 'Bee-YU-tiful!' and would describe tarot decks as more and less powerful based on my observation of responses and biases with respect to decks in general. the power of the deck divides its admirers and detractors more easily, regardless of the attitude of response, by my measure. # I thought it might be one to add to my personal collection. people mean such different things by 'collection' where tarot decks are concerned. I've known people who have bags of decks that they haul around to show-and-tell sessions and intermittently sort on their own, possibly (if they are interested) focussing on one or two which they use to do spreads/readings. sometimes their studies and collection were more important than reading, from what I could see, or their pride was connected to the breadth of their assembly. having seen such people, I've minimized my tarot decks and only recently (because of the novelty to me) begun to form a collection of *non-tarot* cartomancy cards (especially older decks, even antiques). I used to use the Gypsy Witch Fortune-Telling Playing Cards, popular in the US, until I became disenchanted with its predominantly negative overall composition (perfect for Gypsy Candle-Burning Scams!! http://www.luckymojo.com/blackgypsies.html ). since then I've become enchanted with LeNormand and other style Fortune-Telling cards and am in the process of sorting out their relative attributions (32, 36, and 52 card decks used for Euchre or other games than tarot). where tarot is concerned I've focussed on a few decks only (art- or practical-use-orientation; usually in combination with the book written by the occultist). I found the Thoth so potent and strange (coming mostly from exposure to Smith-Waite and "The Pictorial Key" or its Eden Gray spin-offs, rather than the dense weird prose-poetry of Crowley's "The Book of Thoth"), that this fit right into my desires for a deck, and I enjoyed greatly the integration of actual planetary and zodiacal symbols on the cards (Large *and* Small cards!), whereas in other (early, 60s-80s) tarot decks these were less obvious to me or seemed completely absent. over time, however, I began to notice the critical 'voice' of the Thoth deck and sought a deck-book combo that was more light-hearted, supportive, and what in the New Age community that was my entry into esoteric community sought to label 'spiritual'. after examining decks like the very wonderful, feminine and round Motherpeace deck, and other alternatives to martial-masculine Hermetic symbolism running off of Smith-Waite forms, being uninspired by non-Tarotic Osho and Voyager decks, I settled on a multi-varied use of the Douglas-Slinger deck called 'The Secret Dakini Oracle' (SDO) as a *perfect* mate for the Thoth. I've several times used them one after the other for readings, as compensatory or complementary energies and soundings, and found focus on the Harris paintings and SDO and use in altar construction extremely beneficial. the SDO is enthusiastic, tantric, sensual, and accepting. its flowing imagery and the book's positive focus misses some of the blinders of authors like Diane Weinstein and her self- limiting "Positive Magic" style that I found too antiseptic. where it lacks some of the Thoth's power, as I perceive it, the SDO makes up for this in its greater natural focus, allusions to a greater variety of mystical symbolism, and its bare tarotic structure -- being a 65-card correlate to an ancient Saivite dakini-ring that inspired my early temple construction. the artists include a matching of the SDO with tarot and call the '0' card 'Fool' such that it may be seen as a quasi-tarotic deck, although it is a single series of numbered cards, 0-64 (easy for Yijing attribution too!). however, if your collections are not extensive and you are like me and only interested in having a few that you wish to use for readings, the Thoth deck may well NOT BE FOR YOU because of the strength and tenor of its composition. as you can see, my desires were for something 'in-between' the harshness of the Thoth and the sweetness of the SDOracle, but I never found a single deck that sufficed, so used two. # I went to the book store and I had the deck and book in # my hands. I was in line to buy it. Finally, I got out of # line, put it back and left. I had a very strong feeling # that the deck was not for me. I'm not surprised about this. I've seen others react similarly. # Does anyone have any insight as to why I may have had such # a strong negative reaction to the deck? it is difficult to know why without knowing your personality, but there are Crowleyan twists and dark rough edges to the art (note my inexpert artform lingo!). the choice of Trump names and Small Card names probably also has something to do with the response, as do the drippy and rotational aspects to the elemental Small/Court cards (Cups-Water/Swords-Air). my intent in creating a deck will be to integrate the esoteric symbolism of the Thoth and some minor points of its Trumps to the collage artform of the SDO, and will probably therefore obtain some intermediary reactions. I've never seen a strong negative reaction to the Dakini deck, though lack of interest or adoration of is composition was not uncommon at all. the fact that Aleister Crowley is associated with the Thoth deck as the occultist-designer working with Freida Harris is what gives some the willies. Crowley was someone whose early Christian upbringing (Plymouth Brethren) seriously affected his interests in twisting primarily Revelations symbolism to his own particular ironic, hedonistic and controversial ends, and those with Christian backgrounds are sometimes seriously frightened by his writings and influences. 333
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