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alt.magick AMChaos REFerence file

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Subject: alt.magick AMChaos REFerence file
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Summary: This is a REFerence file for the alt.magick newsgroup.  As such
         it constitutes an attendant file to the alt.magick FAQ, which is
         intended as an introductory file and its content may be discussed
         within the alt.magick.* contellation.  The FAQ is available at:
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Reply-to: (tyaginator)

Archive-name: magick/amcref
Version: 1.00 (9508)
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		   alt.magick.chaos: moonly

                       [ALT.MAGICK.CHAOS]: REF FAQ (1/1)

From: Horns
Subject: Defn

  This a component of the Alt.Magick.Chaos files.

  This specific file is a dose of frop and quaff.

  This file is hatefully held hostage by

  One file posted to *.answers, two files posted regularly.

  The working versions are kept at:

  The marked-up (and recursive) version:

  However, if you're looking for something more useful than a faq:

From: Horns
Subject: Index


     01. Glossary
     02. Groups
     03. Books

     04. Definitions
     05. Rants
     06. Frequently Abusive Quotations


From: Horns
Subject: Ed

  The file got too big and I ended up pulling the rogue section.

From: Horns
Subject: Banish

  Before you shoot yourself in the censor with your newsreader,
  read the Statement of Intent in the Main file!

  Edit your quotes!
  Some people do not have a decent newsreader ...
  Some people may even have to download every post!

  Banishment from the group Will Be Accomplished by laughter.

  Any appearance of organization is result of sorcerous attacks
  by the Lords of Order.

  "The common defect of all mystical systems ...
   is that there has been no place for Laughter."
   -- Aleister Crowley

  "Could there be anything worse, and *less* chaotic, then those who
   contribute nothing to magick, and everything to politics, semantics,
   and useless definitions?" -- Tzimon Yliaster

From: Overview
Subject: Glossary

01. Glossary

  AC    Aleister Crowley (1875-1947)
  AOS   Austin Osman Spare (1886-1956)
  AX    Autonomitrix.  A Guild of Chaos.
  COTAO Covenant of the Ancient Ones
  CI    Chaos International. A zine put out by IOT members.
  CM    Ceremonial Magic
  CoS   Church of Satan
  GD    Golden Dawn
  HGA   Holy Guardian Angel
  IOT   Illuminates of Thanateros.  The Pact.
  LK    Liber Kaos: The Psychonomicon by Peter Carroll.
  LN&P  Liber Null & Psychonaut by Peter Carroll.
  OTO   Ordo Templi Orientis
  SOI   Statement of Intent
  ToS   Temple of Set
  TOPY  Temple of Psychic Youth
  TOTEA Tribe of The Eight Arrows

From: Overview
Subject: Groups

02. Groups

    Here are some places that you might be more welcome.





  alt.necronomicon    [spelled right]
  alt.necromicon      [sic]

  alt.mindcontrol     [You WILL read this group and ENJOY it!]
  alt.atheism         [the argument faq is impressive]

From: Overview
Subject: Books

03. Books

  This will be short list of works a neophyte might be interested in.
  There is a seperate file going into gory detail.

From: Data
Subject: Definition

04. Definition

  This is where working definitions will be filtered.

  04.01. IOT: Illuminates of Thanateros.  The Pact.
  04.02. AX: Autonomitrix. "A Chaotick Guild and WorkNet of chaotes"
  04.03. Z: A TAZ.
  04.04. TOTEA: Tribe Of The Eight Arrows
  04.05. CoTAO: Covenant of the Ancient Ones

04.01. IOT: Illuminates of Thanateros.  The Pact.

  Here is the first public notice of the IOT from
  "The New Equinox Magazine", 1978.  Marviously worded ...

  "Spiritual heirs to the Zos Kia Cultus, the Illuminates of Thanateros
  are drinkers of the dual ecstacies of the sex and death gnoses.  The
  IOT represents a fusion of Thelemic Magick, Tantra, The Sorceries of
  Zos and Tao.  The non-mysteries of symbolic systems have been
  discarded in favour of mastery of technique. ... "

  Illuminates of Thanateros POB 17995 Irvine CA 92713
  The contact address for the Americas.

  Illuminates of Thanateros 7349 Via Paseo Del Sur Suite 515-205
  Scottsdale AZ 85258.
  The address for obtaining publications (Chaos International and
  books), shirts, videos, tapes, CD's, etc.  IOT mail relating
  to the Americas will be forwarded to the Irvine address above.

  The IOT have neither a site nor a net contact ...

  Illuminates of Thanateros
  c/o Weiser POB 612 York Beach ME 03910 207/363-4393.
  A last resort ... (dagon productions) writes:

  >To contact Weisser means that your letter is sent to Weisser,
  >then sent to Pete Carroll, then sent to the US Sectionhead.

  From: (dagon productions)
  Newsgroups: alt.magick.chaos,alt.magick,alt.magick.order
  Subject: IOT FYI

  It appears that there is a proliferation of anonymous posters
  passing themselves off as the IOT.  Interesting since the IOT has
  never made any public announcments on any of the Magical Usenet groups.
  The Pact of the IOT has no set policy and no lines ared drawn
  concerning other organizations.  The IOT continues to move forward,
  choosing not to involve itself in the mundane affairs and inane
  postings that make up the majority of the posts to these Usenet groups.

  Douglas Grant for the IOT USA.

04.02. AX: Autonomitrix. "A Chaotick Guild and WorkNet of chaotes"

  From the Nascent Manifesto of 930111

  The name AutonomatriX is derived from the words autonomy and matrix
  to represent a self-directed and self-governing repository of
  information. The emblem of the Auto-nomatriX is a circular blade
  with eight teeth providing a background to the glyph of Eris
  turned on its side.

  The AutonomatriX is a networking chaos magic guild of those striving
  to discover and rejuvenate magical ideas and technical skills with
  success as the only key to validation. We do not discriminate on
  the basis of lifestyle, gender, affiliation, race, or sexuality.
  We seek to interact with creative magicians who are pushing boundaries
  instead of being trapped by them. We are a guild composed of working
  craftspeople, whereas an order/lodge/clique is generally an exclusive
  membership of supplicants.

  The time of centralized info-banks is at an end; the nature of
  "classified" or "secret" information is that it is more often limiting
  than useful to the collector, and only profitable to the banker of such
  media.  Hierarchical structures are unnecessary and undesired; checks
  and balances regarding membership are determined by an individual's
  interaction with the rest of the group rather than personal prejudices
  or acceptance for any member by any other member.  The principles "sink
  or swim" and "(inter)action equals life" are applicable to this magical
  guild, as in any network.

  Information is distributed throughout the entire active membership of
  the network in the issuance of the Contacts Listing and Index of the
  Corpus Fecundi by the AX curators.

  AX/Zetetic Alliance Project   Attn: Nisus
  6230 Wilshire Blvd. Suite #30 Los Angeles CA 90048

  AX/Temple Anaki   Attn: Darakan.180
  422-B 38th Street Oakland CA 94609 or

  AX/Anon Faction   Attn: RoikaXul
  POB 16035 Seattle WA 98116

04.03. Z.

  The Z(cluster) is a group of chaos magicians who have temporarily
  aggregated for the purpose of cracking the universal consensual
  belief structure and thus bringing about the end of the world.

  Originating in a cluster of New Orleans sorcerers who are artists,
  musicians and writers, mostly gay, with a strong contingent from
  the leather community, the Z(cluster) is an attempt to configure
  a new form of organization, one that is non-hierarchichal,
  non-dogmatic, inclusive, anarchistic, and flexible.  The Z(cluster)
  is open to all.  Membership requires a simple declaration.  There
  are no dues.  There are no grades.  There are no leaders.  There is
  no received truth.  Opinions of Z(cluster) members, including
  these statements, are personal and non-binding and may be adopted
  or discarded by members as whim or analytic thought provides.

  If you do wish to contact us, the address follows: or

  Mark Defrates 5014 South Prieur New Orleans LA 70125

04.04. TOTEA: Tribe Of The Eight Arrows

  TOTEA stands for "Tribe Of The Eight Arrows" and is the spawn of
  former IOTer Steve Wilson. Their style of shamanistic Chaos is
  detailed in his book _Chaos Ritual_ (and a fine book it is too!)
  available from Neptune Press (ISBN 0-9505001-9-4).

  TOTEA BM Grasshopper London WC1N 3XX UK

04.05. CoTAO: Covenant of the Ancient Ones

  Currently no valid address.

From: Data
Subject: Rants

05. Rants

  05.01. Chaos Magick
  05.02. Chaos Order

  05.05. Thelemite
  05.06. Satanist
  05.07. Setian
  05.08. Greetings

  05.09. Chaos Star
  05.10. Kia
  05.11. Ouranian Barbaric
  05.12. Colour of MagicK

05.01. Chaos Magick?

  "The Lords of Chaos are
   the enemies of Logic,
   the jugglers of Truth,
   the molders of Beauty"
   -- Hanafax from _The Knight of the Swords_ by Michael Moorcock


  "...if you want a one-line definition with which most Chaoists
   would probably not disagree, then I offer the following.
   Chaoists usually accept the meta-belief that belief is a tool
   for achieving effects; it is not an end in itself."
                        -- Peter Carroll
                           January, 1992


  In Chaos Magic, beliefs are not seen as ends in themselves, but as
  tools for creating desired effects. To fully realize this is to
  face a terrible freedom in which Nothing is True and Everything is
  Permitted, which is to say that everything is possible, there are
  no certainties, and the consequences can be ghastly. Laughter
  seems to be the only defence against the realisation that one does
  not even have a real self.

  So welcome to the Kali Yuga of the Pandaemonaeon wherein nothing is
  true and everything is permissable. For in these post-absolutist
  days it is better to build upon the shifting sands than the rock
  which will confound you on the day it shatters. Philosophers have
  become no more than the keepers of useful sarcasms, for the secret
  is out that there is no secret of the universe. All is Chaos and
  evolution is going nowhere in particular. It is pure chance which
  rules the universe and thus, and only thus, is life good. We are
  born accidentally into a random world where only seeming causes
  lead to apparent effects, and very little is predetermined,
  thank Chaos.

  Reject then the obscenities of contrived uniformity, order and
  purpose. Turn and face the tidal wave of Chaos from which
  philosophers have been fleeing in terror for millennia. Leap in
  and come out surfing its crest, sporting amidst the limitless
  weirdness and mystery in all things, for those who reject false
  certainties. Thank Chaos we shall never exhaust it.
  Create, destroy, enjoy, IO CHAOS!

  From: (Gratuitous Pseudonym)

  >Chaos magick (I have not a CLUE what this is)

  That's a good start.  Chaos magicians are an unruly lot, literally.
  They are basically magickal anarchists and admirers of no rules other
  than their own, arrived at by their own personal experiences.  Many
  of them (but by no means all) have been heavily influenced by the
  Discordian Society and the writings of Malaclypse the Younger,
  worshippers of Discordia, or Eris, Goddess of Strife and Confusion.
  Very few generalizations hold for this kind of magick.

  From: (Tzimon Yliaster)

  It begins with knowing how near and how far Whatever is.  Then you
  concentrate on the placement of objects.  Take neither nourishment,
  nor stimulant nor any drug.  Use pain, when it comes, as a sharp
  wedge into the lower half.

  Dance.  Climb a mountain.  Strip off your clothes (read civilization)
  and break something cherished that owns you as you own it.

  Avoid recruiters, and shoo away those who want to "teach you magick".
  To paraphrase Austin Spare, all any teacher can do is show you your
  own magnificence.

  Examine your obsessions.  What are they, really?  Fuel.  Burn them
  up and move on.  Don't let anything restrict you, least of all
  "groups" (the shortest path to nowhere).  Every group implies
  hierarchy, whatever their press kits may say, and any structure is a
  lessening of the degree of freedom.  Chaos is the greatest degree of
  freedom there can be, as it encompasses all potential and possibility.

  Turn your will against your fears and your insecurities.  Bury
  yourself. Hang upside-down and sing "Hallelujah" in public.  People
  will think you mad, but what's one more madman, and isn't madness
  often little more than the folly of genius?

  You *are* involved!  Everything is involved, and it's really a
  question of what the nature of your involvement will be.
  I hope we haven't kept you waiting too long  :=}

  Try everything.  Be ye manic!!!  We are all our own set of variables,
  and for each of us there are at least slightly different ways by
  which we can shortcut cause-and-effect.  The only secrets are the
  ones that have to do with the ways that work for *you*, even if
  others say you're wrong.  All that matters is effectiveness, and
  the only way to find these keys is to *do*.  It takes time, and it
  takes effort, and maybe even a little bit of your own substance;
  think of it as an investment, if nothing more.  It will, without
  question, pay off.

  But you have to start *now*... because a part of the set of variables
  is time, and its a very limiting factor.

  Lean way back, hold your breath, and count backwards from 418.

  It's begun  :=}

  From: "Joseph Max.555" 

  Chaos Magick is currently the cutting edge of modern Ceremonial
  Magick. It largely grew out of the work of Austin Osman Spare, though
  it has been fractalized into many forms over the last 10 or so years.

  Chaos Magick emphasizes a personal, experimental approach to magickal
  practice, de-emphasizes "traditional" approaches (ie. GD, OTO, et al)
  especially as regards "secret knowledge", male/female dichotomies and
  order hierarchy; what can be learned from Masters or Gurus is far less
  important or effective than what a dedicated researcher can discover
  for hirself. As such, shamanism is incorporated more directly than
  such historical approaches as Kaballa, though most Chaotes are quite
  adept at examining traditional systems, incorporating what works and
  discarding that which holds no personal appeal.

  Chaos Magicians look at Magick as being a _living_ art rather than an
  _antique_ one. They regard the various belief structures of magick as
  being the _means_ rather than the _end_, and the most adept can alter
  their belief-state as easily as they change clothes. Chaos Magick
  recognizes no particular system of theology as having any more
  "reality" than any other, and most Chaotes (like Jung) approach dieties
  as being no more than archtypical constructs of the subconscious mind.
  Therefore they are far less concerned with having any (in their eyes)
  arbitrary moral system pounded into their skulls before getting to
  actually put magickal techniques into practical use than "Old Aeon"
  systems like the GD's or Abra-Melin.

  Chaos Magick propounds no particular dogma or moral system, beyond
  it's most common identifier:
  "Nothing is True, and Everything is Permitted."

  I have yet to meet, however, any adept Chaos Magician who doesn't
  have a strong sense of personal ethics and subscribe to it feverently.

  From: (Lupo the Butcher)

  "Chaos Theory" is generally concerned with making more complex
  physical predictions, sometimes based on a "chaos/order" measurement.
  "Chaos Magick" may or may not be concerned with utelizing paradigms of
  "chaos theory" to exert change in accordance with ones telos
  (in my case it would certainly be the former)...

  "Chaos Magick" may also be the latest attempt to appeal to the
  testosterone junkie set of the magickal community via their
  lust of destruction, much as other LHP groups
  (Satanists & sinister Pagans) do in other ways.

  from Benjamin Rowe

  I have received several complaints about my published rituals
  recently. Some complain that they are too elaborate, others that they
  are too simple, and some question whether they really qualify as
  magickal rituals in the traditional sense. There is some justice in
  all these, and they should be addressed with respect to the work
  presented here.

  The complaints of over-elaborateness stem from the fact that it is
  impossible to perform any significant part of the works in a single
  session. This is perfectly correct, and is done deliberately. My
  experience has been that the rewards given to the magician by the
  "angels" of the Enochian system are very precisely gauged to the
  amount of care and effort the magician puts into the work. Works that
  are planned, rehearsed, and carried out over a period of weeks or
  months are much more likely to produce significant initiations than
  any number of single-session efforts. The present work was designed
  to be performed in stages, with the expectation that each stage will
  be performed until the powers invoked achieve a self-sustaining
  presence in the magicianAs temple before he passes on to the next
  stage. It can be expected that the rewards will be commensurate with
  the effort involved.

  Complaints of excessive simplicity derive from lack of the pompous
  verbiage typically found in formal rituals, and the dearth of advice
  concerning symbols, implements, and materiel that would help to fire
  the imagination of the magician. There is a decidedly bare-bones feel
  to the descriptions. This is perhaps an expression of my own character
  as a magician; I find that complex pomp and ceremony put me off rather
  than enhancing the work. I have complete faith that every magicianAs
  imagination and intuition will provide him with enhancements
  appropriate to his or her own character and style, and so see no need
  to provide more than the minimum schema necessary to accomplish the
  work successfully.

  [from _COMSELHA: A spiritual excercise for Enochian magicians]

05.02. Chaos Order?


  Any appearance of organization is result of sorcerous attacks
  by the Lords of Order.

  From: (Mark Johnson)

  Beware of equating things based on the occurence of the same label.

  We are talking about three things here:

  1.  Chaos science:  the characterization of nonlinear phenomena to
              facilitate a limited mathematical predictability.
  2.  Chaos:  disorder.  The absence or diminished presence of order
              where a higher degree of order is expected.
  3.  Chaos:  the elemental force of creation and destruction, as
              opposed to order, the sustaining and suppressing force.

  3 is the original definition, from the greek.  2 is a common
  misinterpretation, and 1 is a name chosen by mathematicians
  on the grounds that it sounds cool.

  From: (Tzimon Yliaster)
  Subject: Re: Stalking 101

  Tyagi Mordred Nagasiva ( wrote:
  : The way that I define 'chaos', it does *not* include organization.
  : There is no perceivable order inherent to anything that is 'chaotic'.
  : Therefore, 'chaotic organization' is, with this definition,
  : meaningless, and oxy-moron.
  : Tzi, I'd like to know what 'chaos' means to you that it might contain
  : any hint of organization at any time.  Thanks.
  : Tyagi

  Order is a subset of Chaos, temporarily existent at times, and drawing
  its existence from our perception.  A group of individuals may work
  together in a coherent way to accomplish a chaotick act, and when the
  act is finished, move on.  As long as they have done so of their own
  whim and will, then they haven't acted in any way that is counter to
  chaos.  This only comes when permanence is forced upon them.

  Chaos, at a human level, means doing what one chooses, rather than
  following a set of rules.  If this includes a desire to form some
  sort of group to achieve some aim, then so be it.  To *restrict*
  oneself from doing so because of someone else's rules, opinions,
  or perceptions would be far more orderly than to do it.

  From: (The Grin Reaper)

  >If Carrol emphasizes the use of 'chaos' as a source of power,
  >instead of the more positive 'kia',
  >that means he deliberatly chooses the abyss
  >... should I say it ... going into de-evolution ...

  This is only true if you accept two of things as true.
  1] Disorder=Distruction
  2] Chaos=Disorder

  As a Discordian, I feel that these assumptions are more correct.
  1] Disorder= BOTH creative and destructive
  2] Order= BOTH creative and destructive
  3] Chaos= Both Order and Disorder in a formless state.

  For more information consult your pinial gland.


  From: (Fra Semper Non Sequitur)

  An added elaboration is to draw a distinction between Chaos and
  disorder.  To me, Chaos is a level above the artificial distinctions
  of either order/disorder. Hence, to say Chaos (in the higher sense)
  contains order is meaningless, but equally to say Chaos contains
  disorder is meaningless (both being eqully illusory).

  However, in a less lofty sense, I say again that Chaos contains order
  and disorder, organization ( eg the human body / colony of ants),
  disorganization ( muddy water), and plenty of it.
  She aint your average everyday type Goddess.

  The upshot :

  1) With Chaos as above,the fount of all, terms such as
  (dis)organization are quite meaningless.  Take neither term.

  2) With Chaos as below,the 'natural' world, terms such as
  (dis)organization are uesfull only in pairs.  Take both of them.

  3) With whatever Chaos, to dismiss organization and have only
  disorder, is a bizarre worshipping of a single side of a polarity,
  eg Christianity.  Take both or neither.

  From: (Rev. Dr. J. B. Bell)

  Some people have been debating whether all Chaos magick must of
  necessity be anarchic.

  I think the answer is, clearly not.  I personally think of Order as a
  subset of Chaos.  Complete *dis*order is merely entropy, and just as
  boring and awful as total anal-retentive Order.  What makes the whole
  of chaos interesting is the contrast between the schmuzzle and the
  foamy, intricate bubbles of Order.  They form spontaneously, and
  break down just as unpredictably.

  The point, I think, of Chaoism, or at least *my* Chaoism, is not to
  eschew order, but simply to understand its transitory nautre and use
  that.  I may be a Chaos magician, but I rather dig *perversely*
  orderly things like Kabbalah.  They're so incredibly ordered,
  they're chaotic!

  Another point of Chaoism (how could it be *the* point anyway?):  Have
  Fun.  If you need some order to have fun, you should summon it--then,
  when you're done, dispose of it, don't worship it because of what it
  did for you.


  Chaos can be beautiful and good.  Order can be dangerous and evil.
  As any carpenter will tell you, some tools are dangerous.  Dangerous
  tools are safest when properly sharpened, and used by experts.
  You get to be an expert by practicing your sharpening skills,
  not by hacking away.......

  From: (Amanda Walker)

  I'd say that written rules are at their most useful when,
  in fact, they *subvert* order.  Look at the U.S. Constitution, the
  Magna Carta, Civil Rights legislation, and so on.  People are still
  arguing over the Second Amendment...

  Unwritten rules are used far more often to maintain order, since they
  are implicit parts of a world-view, rather than explicit concepts
  which can be critically examined.  Examples are discrimination based
  on race, sex, or academic qualifications, religious bigotry,
  and so on.

05.05. Thelemite.

  "Who calls us Thelemites will do no wrong, if he look but close into
   the word.  For there are therein Three Grades, the Hermit, and the
   Lover, and the man of Earth.  Do what thou wilt shall be the whole
   of the Law."

   Liber AL vel Legis sub figura CCXX. II.40.


  >What's a Thelemite?

  The word was popularized by Aleister Crowley, whom I find quite
  inspirational.  It means one who lives by the Law of Thelema.
  'Thelema' is a Greek word meaning 'will', and this Law was
  expressed by Crowley as 'Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of
  the Law.'  He echoed a scripture which is important to some
  within the Thelemic movement, called _The Book of the Law_.

05.06. Satanist.

  From: (NEMO III)

  Two rather helpful books outside the apparent Satanic community
  were written by California psychologist Lawrence LeShan entitled
  *The Medium, the Mystic and the Physicist* (1974) and *Alternate
  Realities* (1976).  In the second book, LeShan charts out
  approximately four separate but self-contained belief systems
  ("modes of reality")which, when completely entered, permit the
  individual to perform acts considered impossible to the others.
  The key, according to LeShan (as well as to Anton LaVey who
  wrote the same things in 1969, five years ahead of LeShan's
  publications) is to enter into a belief system in which you also
  know, while there, that this and *only* this view of the world
  is true and all others are false.  To achieve that degree of
  belief at will is the key to effective magic according to the
  Church of Satan's view.

  A secondary benefit to this achievement is the delightful
  flexibility the Satanist can enjoy in dealing with other human
  beings and their varying institutions.  The single-belief system
  fanatic can only fight for his views and attempt to convert
  others (usually causing him to alienate just about everyone not
  equally fanatical).  These are the individuals who will often
  quote from stirring patriotic themes to endorse martyrdom to the
  cause.  The Satanist can not merely assume the belief system of
  the ritual and non-ritual in accord with Satanism, but can move
  smoothly through the midst of Christians, Republicans,
  Democrats, Independents, nationalists, agnostics, Moslems,
  racists, neo-nazis, Wiccans, neo-pagans, communists, socialists,
  etc.  The Satanist moves like a predator through the human herd,
  usually unobserved, taking his pick of the best that is offered.
  A true Satanist can go to a party held by his avowed religious
  enemies and have a good time, enjoy the qualities of those who
  have something to offer and return home afterwards feeling no
  guilt or concern.

  To the Satanist charges by others of "hypocrisy" are a clear
  indication of the limited mindset of the accuser.  Ethics are a
  guide to action for the Satanist, not a god to be mindlessly
  obeyed.  All this is beautifully summarized in The Book of
  Satan, Part 2, Verse 12 (The Satanic Bible, page 32), "Whatever
  alleged 'truth' is proven by results to be but an empty fiction,
  let it be unceremoniously flung into the outer darkness, among
  the dead gods, dead empires, dead philosophies, and other
  useless lumber and wreckage!"  The key words to that quote are
  "proven by results."  Results!  That's the purpose of it all.

  Nemo, Priest, Church of Satan

05.07. Setian.

  From: (Michael Aquino)

  The founders of the Temple of Set disagreed with a May 1975 decision
  by LaVey to sell the Satanic Priesthood [and all other initiatory
  degrees of the Church of Satan] for personal profit. Prior to that
  time the Priesthood had been considered a sacred trust, attainable
  by personal merit exclusively.

  When LaVey announced his new policy, approximately 100 of the
  250-total members of the Church resigned on principle. These
  would later become the founders of the Temple of Set. It differs
  not only in its continuance of strict interpretation of initiatory
  standards, but also by an open atmosphere of communication and a
  rejection of Judaeo/Christian iconography.

  From: (Michael Aquino)

  >What is the Setian view on magickal systems, especially those of
  >Carroll, Crowley, and Spare?

  A general answer to your first question may take care of the others
  as well ...

  The Temple of Set approaches "magic" with a very broad brush; magic
  is magic, be it used for whatever purpose. It involves the use of
  principles which have not yet been identified or codified [or
  accepted by the establishment] to be classified as "science". Since
  it is imperfectly understood and applied, it yields imperfect and
  unreliable results. In this it is no different than the science of
  flight at the time the Wright brothers & others were trying to get
  an assortment of crazy contraptions into the air, usually - but
  not always - with comic opera results.

  So today's magician must be prepared to achieve some success, but
  also to screw up a lot. He may take some consolation in being a
  pioneer, but he must also expect that non-magicians will think him
  a nut. Thus it has been with all pioneers throughout history. And
  of course some of them got somewhere, while others didn't.
  No guarantees in this line of work.

  The Temple divides magic into only two "colors" for basic purposes:
  White and Black. While I could give you a variety of technical
  definitions, let's keep it simple: White Magic involves
  self-deception as well as the deceit of others, by being based on
  mere superstition which either has nothing whatever to underpin it
  or which has long since been proven a piece of nonsense. For
  example: Judaeo/Christianity and all "occultisms" derived from
  it, such as the Cabala.
  [Pause here for shock waves to subside.]

  Black Magic is magic in which there is no self-deceit whatever.
  The magician knows exactly what he is doing, why he is doing it,
  and what he expects to accomplish. Associates or assistants also
  do what they do with open eyes. Persons, situations, or things
  which are the *object* of the magical operation may be deceived,
  manipulated, or otherwise changed.

  In this sense a Black Magician might conduct a "White Magical"
  ceremony for purposes of controlling people who believe in it.
  But he would not believe in it, except as a tool, himself.

  This dovetails into your question about Set & other gods. Set is not
  a cartoon-god like YHVH, Krishna, et al. - but is rather a
  *principle* [or *Form* in Platonic terminology] giving substance
  and organization to individual self-consciousness. So while you
  could theoretically pray or talk to Set, in actuality you would be
  praying or talking to the thing which makes yourself yourself -
  but which simultaneously enables other independent selves.

  One of the founding principles of the Temple of Set in 1975 was that
  "all other gods are created by men". This has never been interpreted
  as a "sneer", but simply as an important realization of metaphysical
  truth. It is precisely the psychecentric consciousness which enables
  us to create "gods" and "daemons" to personify wishes, desires,
  prerogatives beyond those to which we are limited as
  inhabitants/prisoners of a mechanical, physical universe. We
  approach becoming gods ourselves - the process which the Temple
  summarizes as _Xeper_ - as we strengthen those aspects of ourselves
  which are not dictated by the objective universe.

05.08. Greetings

+ 93 ... Ia ... Nothing ...

  Nothing is Permited

  From: (Doug Grant)

  The supposed origin of this statement is from the Hassan I Sabbah of
  the Islamic heretical sect the Nizari Isma'ilis, also known as the
  Hashasssins.  The dictum  is seen by some to be the jist of the
  highest level of initiation within the Nizari Isma'ilis, wherein
  the initiates would turn their backs to Mecca and make this
  statement. It has also been attributed to being the last words of
  Hassan I Sabbah on his deathbed.

  Nothing is True - Everything is Permitted is an english
  interpretation of an Arabic statement.

  Other translations appear as:
  Believe Nothing - Dare All
  On Earth There is No Reckoning

  The statement was popularized by William S. Burroughs in his many
  literary works.

  From: "Joseph Max.555" 

  > What do you mean by that statement, "Nothing is true ...?

  There are probably as many interpretations of that particular
  dictum as there are for
  "Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law."

  I can only offer my personal take:

  "Nothing is True" can be interpreted as meaning nothing is
  _absolutely_ true. "Truth" is a theoretical construct, a model
  laid over reality to give it meaning. As Poincare' pointed out,
  there are always an infinite number of _facts_ available. "Truth"
  is derived by choosing amongst those facts and assembling them into
  a meaningful model.

  It's like saying that neither the metric system or the English system
  of measurement is "true". As long as they are self-consistant, they
  are _useful_.

  To quote Poincare':

  "If a phenomenon admits of a particular mechanical explanation, it
  will admit of an infinity of others which will account equally well
  for all the peculiarities disclosed by the experiment."

  So using physics as an example, we can say that Newtonian gravitational
  formulae are "true" - we still use them to calculate the trajectories
  of space probes. However, when speeds approach that of light, they are
  no   longer "true", and we must revert to general relativity to obtain
  consistant results.

  As for "Everything is Permitted", it is merely the consequence of
  the first postulate. If nothing is true, that there are no absolutes,
  the universe is relativistic (which Einstein pretty much established)
  and ultimately arbitrary (and Chaos Mathematics is making a strong
  case for that), then we are given the awful freedom to create
  whatever   universe, whatever reality, whatever TRUTH that we care
  to invest belief in - and the freedom to alter that reality as need or
  desire may require by altering our beliefs by application of the will.
  This, BTW, is what we Chaotes call "meta-belief" - that belief itself
  is only a tool by which we create reality. It is a means, not an end;
  a vehicle, not a destination.

  From: (Balanone)

  Any attempt to translate Xeper literally will fail. Approximately,
  Xeper is most often used as a verb, referring to willful self-
  improvement, self-initiation, self-advancement, and similar self-
  initiated and self-produced advancements in being. Add to that the
  concept of self-creation (Xepera was the ancient Egyptian god known
  for being self-created, did not come from any other source). Add to
  that the idea of metamorphosis, like from caterpillar to butterfly,
  but often discussed as being from child to adult or from man to god.

05.09. Chaos Star?

  "In the distance, he saw the banners of Law and of Chaos raised,
  side by side, the one bearing the eight radiating arrows, the
  other bearing the single straight arrow of Law. And over all this
  hung a huge balance in perfect equilibrium. ... The balance
  sometimes tips. It must be righted. And that is the power of
  mortals, to adjust the balance."
  -- from _The Knight of the Swords_ by Michael Moorcock.

  From: (Rev. J. B. Bell)

  I know at least three Chaos symbols.  The most well-known one in less
  specialized circles than Chaos Magick is the simple eight arrows
  radiating from a single center.  Moorcock appears to have invented
  this one, but it's possible it comes from the U.S. military.

  The next popular one I know of consists of eight rays whose endpoints
  define a square, with a cirle more or less bisecting the longer rays.
  This is a trademarked symbol from Chaosium Games, which among other
  games publishes an Elric role-playing game.

  Finally we have the Star of Chaos that appears to be designed by Peter
  J. Carroll.  It is the familiar eight rays, but the center is obscured
  by an opaque, pregnant-looking circle.

  My symbological interpretation of these:  the first seems to emphasize
  simple dispersion or ordinary material chaos.  The second is more
  about breaking out of boundaries.  The third stresses Chaos as the
  origin of being, and the mystery at its center.

  I ripped off my personal chaos symbol from Grant Morrison, writer of
  excellent comics like _Kid Eternity_ and _The Invisibles_.  His is
  more of a black sun than a star--simply a circle, surrounded by eight
  triangles.  I find the black sun associations quite pleasing,
  particularly when I found much mention of it in music (most recently
  "Black Hole Sun") and alchemy.  It is perhaps symbolically more
  mystical, with a "leap of faith" or intuition, or Gnosis, between the
  original mystery and the radiated points.

  In the section on Yantras, in a diagram on p. 52 of
  _Tools for Tantra_ by Harish Johari, which I admit is a somewhat
  cheesy book, we have a couple of possibilities:  one, a set of eight
  equidistant lines, not arrows.  The header says "Expression. Dynamic."
  Then the aforementioned circle with radiating arrows.  That says
  "Expansion."  Not a perfect match, but close enough to be interesting.

  From: (Frater ABZU)

  The eight sided star appears to be relatively old, - for in the book
  Symbols of Prehistoric Mesopotamia by B.L.Goff, fig.45 shows one
  quite plailnly, belonging to the Hassunah period (7000=+ B.C.E.).

  From: (Sri Palindrome.151)

  The Chaostar, is, in fact, the eight rays as you indicate.  The
  symbol is sometimes used in physics to represent the four
  dimensions of matter (length, width, depth, time), and thus also
  represents the extension of a point to a line, square, cube, and
  tesseract ... by the formula:

  point      "Xiqual Udinbak"
  line       "Xiqual Uzarfe, D'kyeng"
  square     "Xiqual Kudex, Eacht"
  cube       "Xiqual Ashara, Dijow"
  tesseract  "Xiqual Thaldoma, Nobo"

05.10. Kia?

  From: (Sri Palindrome.151)

  Kia is a term coined by Austin Osman Spare as a label for the
  unmanifest portion of the human psyche/spirit/etc.  Thus, the Kia is
  the Chaos within each of us.  Being thus, it is the source of
  inspiration, and the interface between the finite human mind and the
  infinite.  It's also, in a sense, the energy that causes us to grow,
  change, and expand.  Note the similarity between the words Kia and
  "Ki," the Chinese word for the vital energy.

05.11. Ouranian Barbaric?

  From: (Sri Palindrome.151)

  >I don't know the origins or meanings of many of the words mentioned.

  The words are in a language termed "Ouranian Barbaric," which is
  generated via the Ouranos Rite.  Ouranos Baphomet is taken, in
  some quarters, as the "god of magick" and source of the Great Work


05.12. Colour of Magic

  Humor from Prachett's wonderful book made into tragic magic by
  Pope Pete will go here when I can bear to deal with it.

From: Data
Subject: Frequently Abusive Quotations

06. Frequently Abusive Quotations

06.01. Where is the FAQ?

  (please repost answers as needed)

  You just wrote it.
  There is no FAQ.
  Why don't you make one?
  We don't need a FAQ.
  No FAQ I know of.  Do we even get a mention in the various REFs?
  FAQ's are like assholes ... everyone has one but most people don't
    use them often enough.
  There are already several FAQs but no one feels like posting them.
  We had a FAQ but it is being held hostage until you post hard data.

From: Tail
Subject: Banish


  O THOU wicked and disobedient spirit, because thou hast rebelled,
  and hast not obeyed nor regarded my words which I have rehearsed;
  they being all glorious and incomprehensible names of the true GOD,
  the maker and creator of thee and of me, and of all the world;
  I DO by the power of these names the which no creature is able to resist,
  curse thee into the depths of the BOTTOMLESS ABYSS,
  there to remain unto the DAY OF DOOM in chains,
  and in fire and brimstone unquenchable.
    -- some paliomage ...

    -- Tzimon Yliaster

  *giggle* *giggle* *GIGGLE*
  *choke* *hackgiggle*
    -- Tim/Void

    -- Joseph Max.555

    -- Tyagi Mordred Nagasiva

  BHHhhhWWWwwwAAAAAHHHAAAhhhaaahaha !!!
    -- AShTON the UnSubtle

From: Tail
Subject: Ack

  The article skeleton was swiped from the faq.

  From: (Sri Palindrome.151)

  From: (I. Chris English)

  PRINCIPIA CHAOTICA: Chaos Magic for the Pandaemeon

  From: ([Fob])

  From: (Tyagi Mordred Nagasiva)

  From: Shawn Clayton Knight 

  From: (Mark Johnson)

  From: (Lupo the Butcher)

  Benjamin Rowe

  From: (Fra Semper Non Sequitur)

  From: (Doug Grant)

  From: (Michael Aquino)

  From: (Joseph Swails)
  From:  (Joseph Max.555)


  From: (Scott "Blade" Hamilton)

  From: (Tim)

  From: (The Grin Reaper)

  From: (B Heidrick)

  From: (Balanone)

  From: (Rev. Dr. J. B. Bell)

  From: (Frater ABZU)


  From: (Gratuitous Pseudonym)

From: Tail
Subject: End

  go away

=========================== PHYSICAL END ==============================

This document is Copyright (c) 1996, authors cited.

All rights reserved.  Permission to distribute the collection is
hereby granted providing that distribution is electronic, no money
is involved, reasonable attempts are made to use the latest version
and all credits and this copyright notice are maintained.

Other requests for distribution should be directed to the individual
authors of the particular articles.

nagasiva, tyagi
tyagI@houseofkaos.Abyss.coM (I@AM)

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